Simon Liu I spent 21 years in jail since I used to be a baby at 16 years previous. After I first obtained out, I am going again to my mother’s home. I began to search for a job. And simply, I used to be imprisoned since I used to be a 16 yr previous boy. So what sort of job do I get? I meet up with a buddy who I met in jail, who was my pre-calculus trainer, and he was a software program engineer. And he’s like, Simon, do you have got any thought easy methods to get a job? I used to be like, Properly, do you have got any thought? He mentioned, Sure, matter of truth, I do. I’ll introduce you to a buddy. And he launched me to Jessica. And Jessica mentioned, Properly, perhaps you’ll be able to come over to my workplace on Sunday and we’ll check out what you bought, what you’re working with. And after I go over on Sunday afternoon, I’m going into this tech workplace within the monetary district in San Francisco. She gave me some recommendation and a few critiques and she or he mentioned, Properly, you’re not prepared for an interview but. Come again subsequent Sunday. So I come again subsequent Sunday. Once more. And that went on for a month or two. I used to be like, Who is that this lady? Like, on Sunday, she’s working in her workplace. I don’t know a lot about her, however she’s instructing me easy methods to move my job interview and easy methods to be good as a software program engineer. And I believe to myself, if somebody who’s spending her time instructing me on a Sunday to assist me get a greater job, I need to do the identical factor for another person, after I get to the place I must be. I need to assist different individuals, my buddies in jail or launched from jail, to have the identical alternative that I’ve.
Dacher Keltner All of us have these moments after we really feel actually linked with somebody. Once they’re unhappy, we could tear up in disappointment. In the event that they’re completely happy or joyful, we could smile with pleasure. In the event that they’re laughing, we could be part of them in a giggle. And the literature backs it up. Feeling socially linked creates shared emotional states, shared targets, and shared methods of trying on the world.
I’m Dacher Keltner. Welcome to The Science of Happiness. Immediately we’re what occurs to our our bodies and minds after we mirror on our connections. Simon Liu, our visitor as we speak, tried a writing train for our present the place he mirrored on moments of connections that helped form his life.
Simon Liu I spent 21 years in jail since I used to be a baby at 16 years previous. These connections are very significant and powerful for me. These are guys who I develop up with.
Dacher Keltner We’ll additionally have a look at the science behind how feeling linked not solely helps our emotional well-being, it could possibly really change how our brains and our bodies work. Extra after this break.
Welcome again to The Science of Happiness. I’m Dacher Keltner. Simon Liu, our visitor as we speak, didn’t have the connections he wanted when he was youthful. He immigrated to the USA from China as a younger teenager. He didn’t converse English. He give up faculty, obtained kicked out of his home, after which obtained in with the mistaken crowd on the streets of Oakland, California. When he was 16, Simon was convicted of theft. He spent the subsequent 21 years in jail. Simon joins us after attempting a lab examined writing observe, proven to make us really feel extra linked, kinder and wanting to raised different individuals’s lives. Simon is a software program engineer, and he additionally runs this wonderful reentry residence close to Oakland, California, connecting different previously incarcerated individuals with the sources and assist they want. He’s going to be the primary of many friends on The Science of Happiness who reside in or work on this residence referred to as Bay Space Freedom Collective. It’s a privilege to be collaborating with them and studying from their knowledge. On the finish of this episode, we’ll share with you some methods you’ll be able to assist this nonprofit. Simon, thanks a lot for taking a get away of your day and becoming a member of us on The Science of Happiness.
Simon Liu Thanks for having me.
Dacher Keltner I actually admire it. , one of many issues we all know from The Science of Happiness very deeply is that social connections matter as a lot as something. They assist us physiologically and psychologically. And you already know, you got here out of San Quentin, the place you have been paroled after 21 years, and the very first thing you probably did is you created a reentry residence that empowers previously incarcerated individuals, and also you grew to become a pc programmer. Inform us about your journey.
Simon Liu I believe for me, I’m actually fortunate changing into a software program engineer, having the connections and folks that helped me alongside the best way. And plenty of of my buddies don’t have that connection and by no means had the community and the friendships and the individuals of their life that may advance them to get a greater job, to get housing, to get transportation. And the one factor that folks get after they get out of jail, the one connections they’ve is their parole officer. And in the event that they’re fortunate, they’ve a household. And I believe among the causes that they’re in jail within the first place is as a result of they got here from poverty, and their household can’t assist them an excessive amount of. So after I began working as a software program engineer in my firm, I meet all my nice coworkers, very good individuals, however none of them know anybody who’s been previously incarcerated. So I believe to myself, it will be wonderful to attach the individuals who needed to assist and the individuals who wanted the assistance. If we now have a gaggle of marginalized, previously incarcerated individuals on one aspect of our society who’re screaming for assist as loud as they might, after which we now have a gaggle of well-off people who find themselves superb coronary heart and kind-hearted and needed to assist, they don’t know anyone to assist, how can I bridge that hole? That simply gave me the thought. I need to assist different individuals, my buddies launched from jail, to have the identical alternative that I’ve. So we home as much as eight individuals in our home. We do reentry work, we assist them discover jobs, job placement. And we’re their emotional assist community.
Dacher Keltner That’s unbelievable. , your story, Simon, is strictly the story in some ways of life, which is it’s our social connections that make us reside and so they make us survive, such as you mentioned. And so they assist us discover jobs and so they assist us discover houses and so they assist us discover sense of assist. And it’s fascinating that you simply selected for the observe for our present, feeling linked, and actually all that that does, and your story is a vivid illustration of that’s, you already know, you simply take into consideration any individual you have got a robust bond with. You consider a particular expertise with that particular person whenever you felt actually shut and linked, and then you definately write about it. And I’m curious, who did you write about and what was that like for you?
Simon Liu I believe writing about my connections typically helps me perceive that every certainly one of us have, you already know, issues that we are able to relate to, issues that we are able to empathize with. For instance, certainly one of my buddies after I was in jail was a man named Charlie. He did, I’d say 50 years. He was one of many oldest prisoners within the yard. I discovered so many issues from Charlie.
Dacher Keltner Are you able to inform us about one particular second of reference to Charlie?
Simon Liu After I first met Charlie, I met in a poker desk. I imply, in a jail yard, a poker desk is a spot the place it simply. Jail could be very segregated, however I believe the one not segregated place is the poker desk, as a result of cash is inexperienced it doesn’t matter what colour it comes from. So I’m a very good poker participant. I play with all types of individuals. And I met Charlie on the poker desk within the jail yard. And my first interplay with him is after I take his cash a number of instances and I noticed him sitting within the yard bench and he’s not taking part in. On daily basis he goes to play. And I am going over there and I requested him, Hey Charlie, effectively, how come you’re not taking part in video games? He’s like, I misplaced all my cash to you. And I informed him, I mentioned how I win his cash. I mentioned, Properly, your hand shakes each time you’ve obtained hand. He’s actually previous, and his hand shakes each time he obtained hand. And each time he obtained hand, I fold. So then I say, Properly, if we are able to discuss a bit bit and I can sit down subsequent to you, I’ll purchase you ice cream, and we’ll simply discuss, after which I’ll offer you some a refund to the sport. There’s not some huge cash in jail. I gamble like 20, 30 bucks. In order that’s how we began speaking, over ice cream. And he began telling me how he got here to jail and the way he don’t have any household anymore. And he’s getting previous in jail. After which he inform me about all of the warfare story and what they used to do. And his buddies, most of his buddies that have been in jail with him had already died of previous age. Yeah.
Dacher Keltner While you be taught in regards to the origins of the place individuals come from, that simply helps with our social connections. Why do you suppose that’s?
Simon Liu I believe we’re not a lot totally different, and that we’re a lot comparable that, you already know, we care about our household. As soon as we perceive one another, we are able to empathize with one another. All of us have insecurity. All of us make unhealthy decisions. And if given the chance, we are able to all do good.
Dacher Keltner Yeah, I hear you. Phrases of knowledge. So did you do that feeling linked writing observe, interested by anybody else in your life?
Simon Liu I additionally take into consideration the decide who sentenced me to jail.
Dacher Keltner Actually?
Simon Liu Yeah. We grow to be buddies. She is without doubt one of the largest advocates for me. After I obtained out of jail, I reached out to the decide, Choose LaDoris Cordell. And I need to perceive what occurred to me after I was a 16 year-old boy, why I went to jail for therefore a few years. And I needed, additionally needed to specific how I felt. So a journalist helped me attain out to Choose LaDoris Cordell. I believe this is without doubt one of the largest connections in my life, as a result of as a baby, this lady sentenced me to 26 years in jail. I need to perceive why. So we emailed backwards and forwards and we arrange a telephone name. And on the telephone name, I expressed, you already know, how unjust I felt after I was a child that I used to be despatched to jail. I used to be sentenced as an grownup. I used to be an immigrant child who don’t converse any English. My mother and father don’t have any cash to rent a lawyer, so I’ve a public defender.
Dacher Keltner Yeah.
Simon Liu And I talked to the decide. The very first thing I requested is, I actually hated you for many of my life. Now I need to perceive, and thanks for having a dialog with me.
Dacher Keltner And the place did the dialog go? Why do you say she’s some of the necessary supporters in your life?
Simon Liu Choose Cordell defined to me on the time how unjust she felt for my sentencing, however there’s nothing she may do about it as a result of I took the plea discount. And the explanation that I took the plea discount, as a result of my public defender informed me to, or else I’d get life in jail. If I didn’t take the time to attach with the decide, the decide wouldn’t be certainly one of my strongest advocates for my pardon, and for fixing issues up to now. And we’ve grow to be buddies.
Dacher Keltner That’s great. I need to ask you a remaining query in regards to the observe, Simon. And also you’ve given us this wealthy illustration of like what it’s like for you, given your life, to consider these individuals you’re near, Charlie inside and Choose Cardell. And what was it like so that you can write about it? What was that like for you?
Simon Liu I believe writing about my connections typically helps me perceive why. , the connections that we now have in life, there is no such thing as a coincidence. , there’s 7 billion individuals on this world. Why am I sitting throughout from you as we speak? I ask that query usually. And after I realized, you already know, that every certainly one of us have issues that we are able to relate to, issues that we are able to empathize with, it similar to, convey again a lot reminiscence and assist me get to know myself. And the way a lot of myself is in relationships with the folks that I meet all through my life. And in actuality, I understand that I carry a bit piece of them in every single place I am going. They simply by no means left me.
Dacher Keltner Wow. , that’s such a hanging assertion about what phrases convey us, the written phrase, as a result of they’re, they’re these little symbolic issues that hook up with loads of reminiscences and concepts, and so they put all of it collectively. And so whenever you write it down about these shut connections, it makes it all of the richer.
Simon Liu I take into consideration connections as two, the connections that we are able to see and contact and a few that we are able to’t see and contact. And we simply talked in regards to the connections that we are able to contact, and it’s a extra sensible means. We will get issues and get issues carried out. And there are connections that we, we create, and I wish to suppose I create on this world which are stronger than simply bodily connection and sensible connection. As a result of after I exit, construct relationships with individuals, one, I convey my finest self. Two is that I’m real in making every connection. And three is that I additionally take into consideration how my connections on this second will have an effect on down the road perhaps any individual getting out of jail two years from now. How would I have an effect on that connection for them of their reentry, of their success? So I’m actively attempting to construct a relationship or connection that could be a far more intricate net community. It’s similar to a fisherman attempting to repair a web, and every line in these nets are crucial. Even the homeless man on the road that I meet, that connection is effective to me, and I believe perhaps that connection will grow to be an even bigger factor.
Dacher Keltner Hmm. Not solely are you reminding us of how deeply interconnected we’re, and that there’s simply wonderful science on that, that we really feel different individuals’s emotions and suppose what they’re pondering. And it’s at all times, we’re at all times on this net of relationships. However you level us to a brand new observe to be interested by for Better Good, which is like, think about the connections that you simply’re going to be creating along with your work proper now sooner or later. And that’s such a wealthy means to consider what we are attempting to construct within the current second.
Simon Liu Yeah.
Dacher Keltner Simon, I need to thanks. In all gratitude and reverence for the work you do, on your, what you’ve lived by way of and are doing now. And thanks for being on our present.
Simon Liu Thanks for having me.
Dacher Keltner If you want to attach with Simon and assist the Bay Space Freedom Collective, the reentry residence he co-founded, try our present notes for hyperlinks for extra data.
Up subsequent, we’re going to have a look at the literature exhibiting that temporary moments of reference to a whole stranger can’t solely have an effect on our feelings, they will alter our bodily well being, too.
David Cwir Like, who would suppose sharing a favourite creator in widespread with somebody would consequence within the tendency to share physiological states with them?
Dacher Keltner Welcome again to The Science of Happiness. I’m Dacher Keltner. Our visitor as we speak, Simon Liu, began a reentry residence for previously incarcerated individuals, a spot the place they may very well be linked to neighborhood and to sources. We’re going to be listening to from lots of the individuals who reside on this residence, referred to as Bay Space Freedom Collective, over the subsequent yr. They’ll be attempting totally different happiness practices and sharing their very own insights about what they’ve discovered about happiness. I’m actually enthusiastic about what we’re going to be taught from them in these conversations. We talked earlier about how social connections have been proven to make us really feel much less anxious and depressed. They carry us larger shallowness and improve our capability for empathy. However as I discussed earlier than the break, just some minutes of being socially linked with a random stranger may also have an effect on our brains and our bodies. Our podcast’s govt producer Shuka Kalantari spoke with the psychologist who was a part of this discovery.
Haley Grey Truly, Shuka misplaced her voice.
Shuka Kalantari I undoubtedly misplaced my voice.
Haley Grey So I’m going to inform you about that discovery. And I’m Haley Grey, a producer at The Science of Happiness.
Shuka Kalantari Thanks, Haley.
Haley Grey No drawback. So the psychologist Dacher simply talked about is David Cwir. He’s an affiliate professor of psychology at Briercrest Faculty in Canada. Cwir recruited college college students to his lab for an undisclosed experiment. He measured their coronary heart charges after which paired them up into teams of two. Every pair was informed by the researchers that they have been going to be requested a number of questions so they might get to know one another a bit.
David Cwir So, for instance, what’s your favourite film? Who’s your favourite creator? What’s your favourite guide?
Haley Grey That’s David Cwir.
David Cwir And what we did as sneaky researchers, they thought they have been going to be taking part with one other particular person, who was really an actress who was performing like one other participant.
Haley Grey Half of the actresses pretended they shared at the very least three issues in widespread with the scholars. However the different half acted like that they had nothing in any respect in widespread.
David Cwir Think about you’re a participant on this research and also you meet this random particular person and this particular person occurs to share your favourite album is, we’ll simply say Miles Davis, Type of Blue. And the thought is that, by discovering this out, it’s like, Wow, you share that random factor in widespread? You have to be fairly cool as a result of I believed I used to be the one one.
Haley Grey That was the first step. Create a way of reference to a random stranger. On this case, an actress. Then they gave every pair an train activity.
David Cwir The actress was randomly assigned in quotations to run in place for 3 minutes, and the precise participant was assigned to take a seat there for 3 minutes whereas the actress was operating in place. And what we needed to see is whether or not or not members, in the event that they felt socially linked to the actress, whether or not they would really present elevated coronary heart charge and blood stress themselves.
Haley Grey And so they did. Each single time.
David Cwir Contributors who felt socially linked to this actress really confirmed a major enhance in coronary heart charge and blood stress themselves relative to the individuals who didn’t really feel socially linked to the actress.
Haley Grey And people college students who didn’t really feel a connection really had decrease coronary heart charges than they did on the onset of the experiment. It appears we now have these in-built capacities to not solely mirror individuals’s feelings, but in addition their bodily states, simply by briefly feeling linked to them.
David Cwir It’s stunning, I suppose stunning how simply even seemingly minimal cues of connectedness would have these results. Like who would suppose sharing a favourite creator in widespread with somebody would consequence within the tendency to share physiological states with them? And so I believe the lesson is that we’re very a lot social beings, in a profound means.
Haley Grey One limitation to this research is that it was performed solely on college-aged Caucasian girls. So David Cwir has a brand new set of experiments he’s engaged on about how these rigged moments of reference to a stranger may have an effect on individuals of various races, ethnicities, and political opinions.
Dacher Keltner As my mother at all times informed me, there’s loads of energy in asking individuals questions and taking the time to hearken to their responses. Thanks, Haley.
Haley Grey You’re welcome.
Dacher Keltner We’re going to discover 36 questions which have been proven in scientific research to assist individuals fall in love or type extra significant, quick friendships. That’s on our subsequent episode on The Science of Happiness. You could have heard my spouse Mollie and I guiding you thru a few of these questions in one of many episodes of our new Happiness Break sequence.
[Woman 1] I simply broke down crying as a result of I believed, Oh my gosh, that is so stunning. That is any individual who is aware of my coronary heart now in a means he didn’t realize it again then.
[Woman 2] It was type of good to form of snap out of that, like, oh, let’s be light and like take additional care and be like, Oh, yeah. Like, we was scorching for one another.
Dacher Keltner I’m Dacher Keltner. Thanks for becoming a member of us on The Science of Happiness. You will discover directions on easy methods to attempt as we speak’s feeling linked observe in our present notes and likewise at ggia.berkeley.edu. Share with us at happinesspod@berkeley.edu. Or use the hashtag #happinesspod. Our govt producer of audio is Shuka Kalantari. Our producer is Haley Grey. Sound designer is Jennie Cataldo of Accompany Studios. Our editor in chief is Jason Marsh. The Science of Happiness is a co-production of UC Berkeley’s Better Good Science Middle and PRX.
